Sunday Night ‘Rasslin’ With GMB @NRA #guncontrol

GMB left a remarkably bile-free comment with several excellent points on an old post that deserved to be answered. His comment is here in full with my answers to his points in italics.

I sincerely thank you for your thoughtful contribution and do appreciate it as it is far more interesting to discuss contentious matters with someone who disagrees with you-you gain a wider perspective when you can see something from another side and the way to really get there is to grapple with someone who sees it from that way. So let’s get to ‘rasslin’.

How many of these were self defense, suicide, by police…
You can source out every one of them right here and arrange them into whatever categories you like. As of today, 3/3/13, 2453 Americans have died of a gunshot wound since the Sandy Hook Elementary School Massacre. 43 of those dead Americans were children under the age of 12. 126 of them were between the ages of 12-18. 

Tens of millions of American gun owners didn’t kill anyone and never will.
Most people don’t get in fatal traffic accidents yet we mandate manufacturers install seatbelts and airbags as well as meet other safety standards, insurance is mandated, as well as rigorous licensing requirements and strict regulation on usage imposed on car owners; yet freedom still rings.

It is sad that the author seem to have to demean anyone that he doesn’t agree with such as “semi-adults”. Shows signs of superiority complex. Any one with a different view is obviously stupid. It simply means the author refuses to understand another valid point of view.
I’m sorry, were you talking about Ted Nugent or Wayne LaPierre?

First, there were 262 million people murdered by their own government in just the 20th century. “democide” So that is not a serious concern, huh?
What is your solution to this problem?
If you’re somehow implying that I want to have the US government murder me I can assure you this is not the case.
I will briefly try to solve the problem of ‘democide’ or ‘genocide’ or however anyone wishes to give a name to the crimes of Hitler, Stalin, Mao, and the rest of the monsters of history.  In order to prevent genocides a strong international community that is willing and able to bear the cost of enforcing the rule of law and civilization in the face of chaos and evil around the globe is required. The sort of nations that don’t experience genocides are nations with strong economies, stable politics, and high technologies. For this to happen they must have populations that are well educated, well fed, and healthy. What is required of us all personally is a refusal to tolerate racism, a willingness to protect minorities from persecution, and the commitment to never forget what humans are capable of doing to each other when civilization goes sour.

There are also criminals in this world that will do harm to other people. Your ideas will disarm women that enjoy the liberty of going for a jog making her prey to any rapist. It would deny people protection in their own homes.
What is your solution to this problem?
Who goes jogging with an AR-15?
In any case, I don’t think that civilians carrying a lethal weapon is a good idea because it introduces a lethal weapon into every situation they’re in. It is very easy to have a weapon turned against you if you are not prepared for a confrontation, (like when one is jogging). It is far more effective for our hypothetical jogger to try to outrun her assailant while speed-dialing 911. Yelling ‘fire’ is good, too. A small non-lethal weapon would make good sense, as well as staying in well lit and populated areas. It’s also a good idea to not have headphones in and to be aware of your environment. Stay out of alleys and dark corners
I accept the reality that this society is going to be armed. I just want to have a discussion as to the terms.

Law breakers that use guns do not obey the law. They will find ways of acquiring or making guns. “zipgun” Has the war on drugs stopped drugs? Did prohibition stop alcohol? Has government stopped slavery? (12 to 27 million slaves in the world today) Has the government stopped robbery? Has government stopped extortion? (it is now in the extortion business) Has government stopped genocide? (Racist Sanger’s planned parenthood has succeeded in more black babies being aborted in 2008 NYC than were born.)
What is your solution to these problems?
This was your best point of all until you got all foamy at the end there. Still, with the development of the 3D printer your first point is spot-on valid. Which makes it all the more crucial to lock down some standards on this stuff now. Throwing up our hands and saying there’s nothing to be done isn’t an acceptable response. 
Some things to consider-the US Government wasn’t trying to eradicate slavery worldwide, just here. And it did that. It got rid of child labor and improved public health and won world wars. It put human beings on the Moon. It also has blood on it’s hands but show me a nation that doesn’t.
I don’t know why I’m being asked to provide a solution to abortion, but science shows that honest sex education combined with stigma free access to birth control equals less abortions, whereas abstinence only sex ed combined with restrictive and expensive access to birth control equals more abortions and abandoned babies in garbage cans. So there’s that.

It is the people that are the first line of defense in their lives. The 100 pound woman with a gun can defend herself from the 250 pound attacker. It is the neighbor with a gun hearing her scream that can back her up. Most unarmed people will not get involved if they hear someone screaming for help. The criminal knows this.
What is your solution to this problem?
Actually, as I said before, yelling ‘fire’ is proven to bring people to help whereas screaming ‘rape’ or ‘murder’ sends them slinking into the shadows. So, yell ‘fire’. Gunfire always makes people run like hell.
While a gun can be an equalizer in a situation it is also 49 times more likely to be used to shoot yourself or a member of the family than to shoot an attacker.

Right to life liberty and property apply to every individual, until they infringe on the rights of another. Your careless disregard for the life of any individual law abiding citizen to be able to defend themselves is shameful.
I maintain that the right of any screwball to get his hands on military weaponry and unlimited ammunition is an infringement on the rights of the rest of us. Your reckless disrespect for the power of these firearms is shamefully childish and endangers us all. Nowhere have I argued for a total firearms ban or confiscation or any such nonsense. Please learn to listen with your eyeballs.

A woman in Texas testified before congress that government intimidated her to leave her weapon in the car. She and her mother and father were eating in a restaurant with a bunch of other unarmed victims when a man crashed his vehicle through the wall and started killing people. If any one person had been armed, many of these 23 dead people would still be alive. Both her parents were murdered. “Luby’s massacre” If the video of Suzanna Hupp testifying before congress doesn’t bring tears to your eyes, you are heartless and a lost cause.
If the madman wasn’t armed he wouldn’t haven’t been able to shoot anyone. Anyone who doesn’t understand this is a crazy stubborn asshole.

Do you know why you seldom hear of mass murderers stopped by armed citizens? Because they are stopped before they become mass murder.
No. It’s because it has never ever happened. Harboring an adolescent fantasy of gunning down a madman in some kind of slow motion Hollywood wank off is understandable; what is pathetic is to believe it.

This utopian fantasy of a safer world without guns ignores human nature and is unachievable. Why do we have guns? because they became the most effective equalizer to the bow and arrow, the sword, the knife, the bully, the dictator, against other guns, … They are a tool. A tool of defense, of hunting, of pleasure.
Again, I’m in agreement with you until the last word. When I first read this my inner ‘reader-voice’ of you got all husky and dragged out ‘of pleasure’ against my will and I couldn’t stop giggling. 
But you’re right. They’re a tool. They’re here because they’re useful and any nation that foreswore them wouldn’t be a nation for long. I’m not a utopian advocating the eradication of guns. I’m just saying we should treat them with the seriousness that they deserve.

The recidivism rate of a dead rapist is zero. It corrects human nature. To use a leftist meme, the murderer could be the next Picasso, well so could the victim.
That’s awesome, Judge Dredd. I have no idea what you mean by a ‘leftist meme’ regarding a murderer being Picasso but I don’t think that murder victims aren’t capable of being Picasso if that’s what you mean?
The truth is, violent street crime has gone way down in my lifetime. I’ve had my adventures; a drunk cop pointed a loaded gun in my face when I was a 19 year old bouncer in a skeezy South Side bar. I had a pimp slap me when I intervened on the street between him and a girl when I was armed with nothing more than a cell phone and a sketchbook. I have passed through flocks of crack zombies and talked down madmen and muggers alike. I’ve walked through all kinds of cities and all kinds of neighborhoods at all times of day and night and I have never wished to have a gun, regardless of the circumstances I have been in. I find that it is far more important to be armed with my wits and a calm clear mind when situations become dangerous than to go around constantly prepared for an armed confrontation.
This doesn’t mean that I want our society to ban all guns or that I don’t want there to be a healthy appreciation of guns with a culture of respect for these weapons as the incredibly important tools that they are. I see no need for hunting or sport culture to be negatively impacted. I absolutely want Americans to be able to be the best marksmen in the world and to have a rational relationship with these weapons without public safety being unduly jeopardized or the Constitution being infringed. That’s not happening at the moment and the policies of the NRA are serving those of weapons manufacturers, not the American people. That’s what needs to change.
Thank you again,
Winston Delgado
The Furious Buddha   

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