I’ll see your turd and raise it with this shotglass of piss.

I would like to apologize to the regular guests of the Teahouse. I know this sort of thing isn’t that interesting to you, but it gives me all sort of ticklish giggles. I have to admit that I really cherish these moments.  

Grasshopper
I’m not worried about your towering intellect blowing my mind. Rather, I’m not interested in wasting time trying to squash a bug, although I’ve already wasted days doing that. You posted your fatuous question to a post that had the following paragraph in it:

‘The farther away now moves from an event the more distorted our perspective of the event becomes. Eisenhower knew this. He said ““I made the visit deliberately, in order to be in a position to give first-hand evidence of these things if ever, in the future, there develops a tendency to charge these allegations merely to ‘propaganda.”He brought civilian and military photographers and reporters to the camps for a reason. The evidence they compiled is irrefutably mountainous.’

If you could read that paragraph without the blinders of mental illness or outright stupidity, you would understand why I feel your question is not worth addressing. Let me ask you one: Have you even read the memoirs of Eisenhower, Churchill or De Gaulle? Regardless of what may be found there, yours is a leading and dishonest question: what does it matter of De Gaulle or Churchill didn’t specifically mention gas chambers in their memoirs? (If you look at the quote above you might understand why I don’t mention Eisenhower here.) That’s like asserting because Nixon didn’t write about Apollo 11 the Moon landings never took place. That you are using this pointless rhetorical trick to cover up Nazi crimes makes you worthy of whatever dismissive scorn I feel like heaping on you. I suppose that’s why I’m bothering to talk to you; I rarely get to swing Sarcasticus so freely without worry of giving offense or hurting feelings. But your only hope of coming to your senses is to get a glimpse of yourself to see how twisted you are.

I have read the documents concerning Zyklon-B, among other things. IG Farben was worried that their patent might be compromised if they removed the irritant indicator (the safety feature that let you know you were breathing deadly poison) as the Nazis demanded. Actually, the documents concerning Zyklon-B are numerous; there are thousands of pages of correspondence to say nothing of the trial transcripts on this subject alone. Then there’s the residual traces of it in the actual gas chambers. If you possesed honest intellectual curiosity regarding the use of gas chambers by the Nazis during the Holocaust you could satisfy it with the mountains of evidence that exist rather than asking pointless leading questions and thinking that doing so makes you a daring genius. It doesn’t. It makes you an ignorant crank with a persecution complex.

-Winston Delgado

*This comment was posted at Jezekiah’s website as a response to ‘A Carbon Sutra for the Furious Buddha’ at 10:21am Chicago time. He has comment moderation on so we’ll see what happens next:

Oh, and PS. You didn’t know I existed until you googled your pseudonym. I didn’t know you existed until wordpress decided to feature your ignorant bloviations as one of their ‘hot community blogs’. So really, all your crying about your hurt feelings is self-serving and weird. You are a very touchy narcissist.
-Winston Delgado

At 8:07 PM this evening I noticed that Jezekiah published this:
(note: I received and deleted three replies from the Furious Buddha, each of which I deleted due to their being filled with nothing but but invective and ad hominem. I’d like to thank FB for playing perfectly to form. – jezekiah)

So I responded with this at 8:16pm:
Jezekiah-
My, but you are a very sensitive soul, aren’t you? I wear your censorship like a badge of honor, and have no fear, I have preserved our correspondence for posterity. I doubt you will be eager to pingback or link to me any time soon. It will be interesting to see if you consider this message to be ‘invective and ad hominem’. 
I wonder, if one person signs their name and the other uses a pseudonym, how can the pseudonymous writer seriously accuse the other of ‘ad homenim’ attacks? How can I ‘argue against the man’ when I don’t even have any evidence that you’re a man? 
-Winston Delgado.

Around 9pm Chicago time Jezekiah responds:
Excellent, son. You’re almost learning how to be reasonable.

Keep at it and someday Reason will break through your emotional attachment to the mythology that we were all raised with.

regards,

jezekiah

Now, if all of Jezekiah’s readers will go over to my Teahouse, you can see what he couldn’t bear to have you see here, which is a perfectly reasonable answer to his assertions. Obviously, it’s the presentation of evidence and refutation of your point that you can’t tolerate. You whine and whine that I won’t answer your question and when I do, you delete it and then cry that I’m mean and call you names. You are not very good at defending your assertions. That’s not an ad hominem attack, it’s an observation of fact.
-Winston Delgado
The existence of the camps was never in question. Where you’re stuck is the fact that Eisenhower NEVER mentions gas chambers. Show me where Eisenhower or Churchill ever mentioned mass extermination by gas chamber and then you might have something.

If you want your comments to appear on my blog (as you seem to), just refrain from ad hominem and invective. It’s easy.

later, gator-

jezekiah

My response at 11:45pm 2/28/09:
I find it interesting that you are so focused on this particular question phrased in this particular way. For one, it is a line of argument that is propagated on white supremacist websites. You appear to be trying to ‘mainstream’ this idea here by being polite and not using the typical ugly speech of your comrades. That’s why your crocodile tears shed from the terrible things I say about you are so darkly ironic and your demands to be treated with dignity are so pathetic. Secondly, you are demanding that I prove something to you that is already proven; you refuse to do any homework and blame the teacher for your ignorance. Fine. So be it. Here’s your lesson for the day:

“A distinguishing feature of the Dachau Camp was the gas chamber for the execution of prisoners and the somewhat elaborate facilities for execution by shooting. The gas chamber was located in the center of a large room in the crematory building. It was built of concrete. Its dimensions were about 20 by 20 feet, and the ceiling was some 10 feet in height. In two opposite walls of the chamber were airtight doors through which condemned prisoners could be taken into the chamber for execution and removed after execution. The supply of gas into the chamber was controlled by means of two valves on one of the outer walls, and beneath the valves was a small glass-covered peephole through which the operator could watch the victims die. The gas was let into the chamber through pipes terminating in perforated brass fixtures set into the ceiling. The chamber was of size sufficient to execute probably a hundred men at one time.” From Document No. 47 of the 79th Congress, 1st Session, Senate Report (May 15, 1945) of the Committee Requested by Gen. Dwight D. Eisenhower to the Congress of the U.S. relative to Atrocities and other Conditions in Concentration Camps in Germany. This document was entered into the Nuremberg trial proceedings as IMT Document L-159

Just leave this up and I will leave you be, sir. You may cavil or hem and haw as you please, but I am finished with your lesson. It is worth what you paid for it.
-Winston Delgado

26 Responses to “I’ll see your turd and raise it with this shotglass of piss.”

  1. jezekiah Says:

    Replied. Hope all’s well.

  2. Dear anonymous person;
    You regurgitate the nonsense of Arthur Butz and David Irving with typical insect mindlessness while refusing to acknowledge reality. You mistake your anti-semitic conspiracy theories for intellectual daring. You also overestimate your insightfulness; for example, I’m seven years old and I still see right through you. Class is still dismissed, bug. I have no formal education, no degree; I am not part of the intellectual intelligencia, nor am I a Jew; I earn my bread while wearing a blue collar and my education was overseen by myself. I am not what you think I am but you sure seem be everything I say you are, and I say that you are mistaken in your beliefs. Reconsider them.
    Winston Delgado.

  3. Dear Guests of the Teahouse;

    Wow. Okay, yes, I knew that exact sort of thing would happen: Holocaust Denialist demands precise bit of evidence with a particular swirl on top (in this case, ‘Eisenhower mentioning gas chambers’). Precise bit of evidence with partuclar swirl on top delivered to Holocaust Denialist. Holocaust Denialist then falls into fit of self-referential cavil explaining how white is black and the evidence is all inadmissable and not what it seems to be at all. Asserts that they know better because they’re fifty. Goes on believing the Jews just made it up so we would feel sorry for them and give them Israel, or whatever motive they feel is useful.

    On the plus side, and Lily always appreciates this, while I am arguing with these people I am at least distracting them from doing something awful to some other person.
    WD

  4. Brian Radford Says:

    Is it not accepted by both traditional and revisionist historians that there was no functioning gas chamber at Dachau? And the mock-up there (a shower room made up to look like a gas chamber) actually has a sign stating it was never used as such? I visited in late 2001 and saw the sign myself. Just curious. I also seem to recall that it is now thought that there was never any ‘gas chamber’ or ‘extermination camp’ in Germany, but they are alleged to have been in Poland only: thinking that has changed over the last 30-40 years.

    *** FB NOTE****The above are easily refuted lies.

  5. And the grand parade of pointless sock puppetry rolls on.

    See, the I poked ol’ Jezekiah with the fact that he’s posting anonymously, so now ‘people’ with ‘real names’ are posting here. Also, he deleted my perfectly rational question about the mountains of evidence regarding Zyklon-B from his site. Clearly, he is interested in rational debate.

    Grandpa, you are so very predictably crazy.
    Seek help and medication.

  6. henry balfour Says:

    ‘sock puppets’ ?? Real people, and I’d like to nominate myself to that collective noun, find this WD blurt tiresome. Deal with “Denial” all you will WD, it’s actually increasingly the province of clear thinkers to ask these sorts of questions that you treat with such hysteria. I’m dispassionate enough to be able to parse comments from both the Shoa group and the so-called “deniers” and on a points score basis, it’s not going to well for the Shoa group. The story keeps changing, see? And one more thing WD; most of the dialogue on this subject is not accurately described as denial. If you understand the definition of denial you would have to agree. Most discussion is purely on empirical research. You lose every time you comment – best to stop digging once you are in a hole.

  7. I’ve been to Dachau. Of course, Dachau’s no proof to these people that it’s all fake, just like the moon landings were. 🙂

    BTW – I see jumpin’ jezek’s jam-job is cluttering up the wp.com front page again.

  8. Winston,
    I am Jezekiah’s psychiatrist. Please stop taunting him or he might end up running naked through the streets while shrieking about the Zionists. He’s done it before. Hopefully he hasn’t started in on the booze yet. It’s kind of early in the day for that.
    Dr. Slappy

    PS-I am not a sock puppet. I am a real boy.

  9. Jesse Cargill Says:

    You’re really not attempting any thought experiments here. Why don’t you lay off the outrage and just suspend your disbelief for a moment and say “what if they’re right?” (I know why-you’ll say that its disgusting or some such copout.) But where is the outrage at the criminals that covered up/whitewashed other genocides? The UN in Rwanda, the US in Indochina, white Euros in the Americas and the triangle slave trade – and dare I say it, Israel in Gaza. Whats the difference between murder in a chamber and murder from the sky? God says, though shall not kill. Period. Well, some people think that not all humans are created equal, ie there are a chosen few – all else are insects. Question Authority.

  10. Jesse-
    I imagine life as a sock puppet must be very difficult, especially when you have a mentally imbalanced person shoving their hand all the way up into your brain. I hope you realize that you are annoying a cartoonist. I am going to have so much fun with you.
    -Winston Delgado

  11. I really don’t understand the point these “deniers” or what ever you call them are trying to make? Several millions were killed, but not by gas, so it isn’t a genocide? Are all genocides non-existent because we didn’t respond to them? Americans and Brits (or the Belgians, or the French or the UN or whoever is ignoring Darfur) did nothing ergo the genocide didn’t happened? Winston, you’ll have to explain this to me. I have advanced degrees and have been asked to work apply to a PhD program and you are still smarter than me in some things. And to answer Jesse’s question about outrage, I offer some names: Dietrich Bonhoeffer, an ordained minister who risked his life and his soul in a plot to kill Hitler. Oscar Schindler, who risked his life to save Jews. Paul Rusesabagina and General Roméo Dallaire in Rwanda.

    Remember, it was people arguing over the meaning of the word “genocide” that kept the US from stopping the killing in Rwanda and we are now doing the same in Darfur.

  12. Kenny,
    They were killed by gas. This whole notion that nobody was killed by gas is one of the wedges that Holocaust Denialists are trying to jam into the cracks of our collective memory. They are throwing the ashes of the dead into the eyes of the living in an effort to obscure history. They lie with absolute confidence and ignore truth with comfortable authority; they even got you to parrot their propaganda with your innocent question. They are not seeking to prove anything, but rather to sow doubt and confusion in the minds of modern people about Nazi acts of genocide; this is why they are not deserving of dignified debate and discourse, this is why they earn our mockery and scorn.

    Also, as Jezekiah’s doctor, I can assure you that he has brain herpes, which explains why he is such a zany nut.
    Dr Slappy, a totally real doctor person who is not a sock puppet of the Furious Buddha.

  13. I am not sure who they are trying to convince other than themselves I guess. Reasonable people understand what happened.

    And for the record, my grandfather – full blooded German – WWII German Army Veteran – detained on the Russian front in a work camp by the Allies – not a great fan of the Jewish people – fully admits to the destruction done to not only the Jews but other minorities as well. There were death camps, there were gas chambers. He was there.

    So blow on…seems like life has much more to offer by looking forward and embracing the future than trying to disprove the past.

  14. They are trying to create an alternative belief system that their fellow travelers can buy into-it becomes much easier to revive fascist dreams if you get people to forget the nightmare.

    On the plus side, I’m keeping him occupied from bothering anyone else.
    WD

  15. Brian Radford Says:

    FB, I need you to answer something for me. Can you explain the results of the Austalian group who went to Treblinka, drilled for core samples, used ground penetrating radar etc and found no evidence that the earth surrounding the alleged camp was ever disturbed? They surveyed the exact area where popular tradition states that over 700,000 bodies were interred, then dug up and filled in again…? I dont understand how this can be, yet the myth continues…I am open minded and educated, so I guess I need some answers to this one, as the evidence seems to fly in the face of the story in the ‘history’ books. Thank you for your time. Please be rational and refrain from calling me a sock-puppet.

  16. Brian Radford Says:

    FB, I am relatively new to this topic. What I need to know is this…. Why is debate not allowed? Why, when I read something questioning the official version, is it seemingly well researched, evidence based and rational, yet most everything from the ‘official’ side is broken down into smear attacks, name calling and the like? I dont understand WHY there can be no rational, reasoned debate. We debate the existence of God. We debate the meaning of life. We even debate climate change (more so now than 5 years ago) Why is someone sent to prison for wishing to debate this? Or for questioning the official narrative? If the official story if legitimate, why not debate it so that you can prove the story? Why hide behind name calling, fear mongering and even death threats? Why not give empirical evidence? Not coerced testimony. Not figments of imagination. We saw where that got us: tales of soap and lampshades and skin book covers… Please, I need some credible evidence.

  17. Brian-
    Can you explain to me why Jezekiah (he’s the bug who has his hand up your backside) deleted the answers to all of these questions from the comment thread on his blog? Why is he so afraid of a conversation about Zyklon-B?
    Winston Delgado

  18. Brin Radford Says:

    See Winston, there you go again with derogatory insults. Why do those who view the official narrative as gospel behave in such a manner? Those searching for truth and a debate about this are not being anti-semitic, theyre not inciting racist behaviour (as far as i am aware, it was not only Jewish people killed: homosexuals, political insurgents and mentally deficient as well) I just cannot fathom that one can be imprisoned for thinking something. George Orwell must be laughing right now! I would thoroughly enjoy watching a debate on this topic, but it isnt allowed, or degenerates into a verbal slanging match, where insults are traded and names called. Just the evidence, Winston, minus the name calling, please.

  19. Brian Radford Says:

    And for the record, I know neither of you. I came across Jezekiah’s blog via a link at another site whilst looking for information regarding the Holocaust. And I followed the discussion with you, so came to your blog looking for answers. I am an Australian doctor of medicine. I am not stupid, I consider myself well educated and travelled. I am a married father of 2 young boys, and I just want the truth. Not something sugar-coated. I do not care how awful it is. I do not wish for my sons to grow up in a world where things may not exactly be as they seem. Kindly drop the name calling and participate in an intellectual discussion.

  20. Guests of the Teahouse;
    Note how this sock puppet buried my question about Zyklon-B under two paragraphs of hot air. See how it demands that I behave according to his wishes? Wonder at how disinterested parties who have nothing to do with Jezekiah are so interested in my behavior towards him.

    Winston Delgado

  21. Brian Radford Says:

    Winston, I cannot answer for Jezekiah. You asked me to answer on behalf on someone with whom I have no association. Then, call me a sock-puppet. You call my two paragraphs ‘hot air’…. well, refute them with evidence. I kindly asked you to refrain from using abuse or name calling. It seems that without your typical antics, that you cannot argue your case. I am more than happy to discuss this topic, and many others in an adult and logical manner. I shall not revert to your games. You are ever so quickly falling into the same game plan of so many others. I will repeat myself again: I do not know either you or Jezekiah. And once again, please refrain from name calling: it is not doing yourself justice.

  22. […] to explain their views on historical events. You are Jezekiah, which isn’t a real name either (though there is a Brian Radford in Melbourne-he’s a management analyst, not a doctor. Also, i…. Which makes you an anonymous nobody who is terribly frustrated and angry about many things. […]

  23. Brian Radford Says:

    Oh FB. You googled me?! I should be so honoured. Now, why would you do that?
    Yes, I am a doctor. Yes, I am educated. I am also an atheist, a father, a husband, a brother, a neighbour, an uncle, a nephew and an athlete. Does that change the way you view me as a ‘nobody?’
    No, I am not terribly frustrated and angry about many things. I dont see the link, I’m sorry.
    I am here trying to get some answers, but all I seem to get from you is ill-advised name-calling. Not a single answer has spewed forth from your keyboard. It really is quite amazing how you are living down to the stereotype. C’mon mate. LEts get back to the topic at hand and give me some evidence. Pure and simple. No soap or lampshade stories. No ignorant name calling.

  24. (Dr Slappy enters. He is wearing a red nose and a white lab coat. He has a stethoscope dangling from his ears. He is carrying a large fish. He regards the doll opposite him being held by a performer cloaked in darkness. The doll is a Crocodile Dundee action figure wearing a little lab coat.

    Dr Slappy turns to the audience and arches his eyebrow like Bugs Bunny. He then holds up a sign with a screw and a baseball on it. He drops the sign and slaps the doll with the fish. Dr Slappy pulls the black clad puppeteer into the spotlight and removes the mask, revealing… nothing. The puppeteer’s clothes fall away from Dr Slappy’s empty hands. Dr Slappy takes a bow.)
    Fini

  25. Brian Radford Says:

    ok, enough said. have fun in dreamland.

  26. Brian Radford Says:

    its funny, you’ve proven my point exactly. i really thought you would engage me in a chat on this topic. but, its your blog. thanks for the enlightening conversation.

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